Subject: UEFA Euro 2016

Best teams in Europe aren't 3-4 places, but actual champions.

Well, you can believe that, but that won't change the fact that this is obviously untrue. It happens now and then that a team like Olympiakos can beat a team like Manchester United (because they are in terrible form). But still, the team that ends up third in England will most of the time be a better team than the champion of countries like Greece, Belgium, or even the Netherlands. You can deny this, but then again, you can also deny that gravity exists.

8 best leagues will have seeds and 8 slots from qualifications

So only 16 teams?

I prefer a competition between the best teams in Europe.

I have nothing against it, but that would be a different kind of tournament, like a European League, with national leagues as second divisions to it. But, despite their threats, you'll never get Real Madrid, Bayern, Inter, etc, risking being 10th or so in such a league, or even fighting to avoid relegation. They are way too comfortable being always 1st or 2nd in increasingly uncompetitive leagues, and then having the upside risk of winning CL without the downside risk of doing poorly (in the end what counts is who winning, and not-winning is a bit disappointing but not percieved as bad as finishing a league in 14th position or being relegated).

Annd it can also happen that Red Star or Steaua win the tournament.
Or, it could happen, not anymore... The problem is that the system is self-reinforcing. The more we organize the tournament counting on a few leagues having the best teams, the more money these leagues will get, the more true it will become...

I'm just pointing out that it is bullshit to say that if you want the best teams to play against each other, you cannot have a tournament with only the champions of the national leagues (like Gosen was saying).

I do realize there is a big financial gap between the big leagues and the smaller ones (including Belgium). And yes, I do consider it a problem. But just making a financial less interesting European Cup is not a real solution if you ask me. The money in European club football should be more redistributed between the European countries. But I haven't put much thoughts in how that could be done, so don't ask a solution from me ;-)

I do realize there is a big financial gap between the big leagues and the smaller ones (including Belgium). And yes, I do consider it a problem. But just making a financial less interesting European Cup is not a real solution if you ask me. The money in European club football should be more redistributed between the European countries. But I haven't put much thoughts in how that could be done, so don't ask a solution from me ;-)

Well, it is the liberalism in his plain action, nothing more... Do you think richest teams could donate to poorest teams in Europe or maybe we would have to use a government to use taxes to control redistribution ? ;-)

I wouldn't be too hasty in calling it "liberalism", at least in the economic tradition sense: what happens with money in football has "monopoly" written all over the place, at several levels... And the artificial ("legal") kind of monopoly.
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But current CL could stay but in different name and format. I would totally remove EL, no point watching average teams. Is there WC for weaker teams? Is there Euro for weaker teams? No, so why bother. Champions Cup, European Cup (current CL without champions and best x number could eventually qualify to real CL) and that's enough. Cup Winners Cup - ok, but come on, watching games like Sevilla-Maribor or Rubin-Betis is only interesting for their supporters. You like EL, so I told you before, why don't make a Cup for 2nd leagues? Seriously, tournament for 5-6th places is garbage. I don't mind watching Albanian and Bulgarian champions, but watching Genk-Anzhi or Alkmar-Liberec, wtf, who cares?

Well, it is the liberalism in his plain action, nothing more... Do you think richest teams could donate to poorest teams in Europe or maybe we would have to use a government to use taxes to control redistribution ? ;-)

This has nothing to do with liberalism whatsoever. The UEFA is not a form of government. It is a voluntary organization. Clubs can participate, if they accept the rules of the UEFA. They are perfectly allowed to create a new organization if they disagree with the UEFA rules.

I don't mind watching Albanian and Bulgarian champions, but watching Genk-Anzhi or Alkmar-Liberec, wtf, who cares?

With all due respect for Albania and Bulgaria, but quite frankly, I don't give a shit about their champions. (Not that I care about Anzhi or Liberec. EL is stupid.)

The market of player is a free market no ? Investors are free to use their capital in any club association of their choice, no ? They can make money and they redistribute some part of this money to his national federation and international federation for the development of football, no ? Where it is not a liberal system ?
And about UEFA, i never said it was a governement :-p (y know i'm not good in english but you read very bad today :-p)

My liberalism is a political opinion. This is a football topic. Let's keep it that way.

If you cannot see the difference between my views on government and society and my views on football, then that's your problem. Let's not annoy other people with that.

But no, football is most certainly not a free market.

I really do not care about your liberalism view :-D... You answer about my liberalism view, thus if you don't concerned about that do not try to answer that's the best way to let people to talk about football :-p

I only wanted to have fun with words... Against freedom of speech ? Not smart enough to see that ? ;-)

But let's talk about football, yes, and i'm a favor of a closed European League to see only the very best players.

The French have always had a strange sense of humor. Not to use the word poor.

The Kingdom of Belgium has some very smart people in his community, unfortunaltely i'm not lucky... Want to play football ? :-)

But it's the same in Champions League. We don't have actual champions but weaker teams from 3rd or 4th places, it's boring, I would rather see true Champions League not random European Cup. And instead of Europa League put those teams from 2-4 places there. I don't give a shit about 5-6 places and EL at all. Fuck that and make three tournaments: CL, EC and eventually Cup Winners Cup. No need to make tournament for average teams, because now I can say, well... if 5-6 places have their own cup why not 2nd league Champions Cup, lol?

CL group: Barcelona, Chelsea, Juventus, PSG
EL group: Real, City, Napoli, Monaco

pretty nice, right? of course there are champions from weaker nations, but hey... there are actual champions and they can always make qualifications for that as well

mostly, i disagree with you...only 16 teams qualified means you won`t see too many tough matches, and also team like arsenal, liverpool, monaco, atletico madrid/barcelona, dortmund, milan/inter( and the list can continue) will be out of this competition...and it would also be a financial dissaster for these teams
champions league will become a rather average competition, like it was before 1991

mostly, i disagree with you...only 16 teams qualified means you won`t see too many tough matches, and also team like arsenal, liverpool, monaco, atletico madrid/barcelona, dortmund, milan/inter( and the list can continue) will be out of this competition...and it would also be a financial dissaster for these teams

You will have European Cup/League for that