Subject: »[info]DevDiary 80: “Price is what you pay, value is what

Make 1 read only summary topic with 2 editable posts by you and below all "new things implemented" and all "next on the agenda" points.
So you have the 1st post which contains all things allready implemented, being edited with all new things implemented, and have the 2nd post wich contains ALL "agenda points for things to come", being adjusted when some points will be "done".
Thing is, also have each "new" thing posted in separate posts, so people can see clear what's new now AND they know the 1st and 2nd posts contain ALL summaries of both new things to come and things to be completed.

Well, as the majority of voters wanted the International Cup, no screen means displeasing the majority. So, for that not to happen, I could hold the International Cup and put the option of "resign" for that team that does not want to participate and stay out and do not have the possible 4 games.
Next time, please do not put anything to the vote because there is nothing more frustrating than winning and not taking.

I have not seen in any forum, what will happen with the training of the players? The fewer weeks per season the active age of each player decreases.
It has been commented that there will be more games per week but it has not been said how this will influence the evolution of the player.
Where will the talent be?
What will be done with the age of the player?
How will this influence the game?

Dev Diary 5

Now Raul about playoff game. Somewhere you said it wont be fair if half league goes in lower division since we dont have playoff. Status for now will be 4 bottom teams plays and lower division champions. Please make a pool about it in polish forum and here and please also make connection with expansion level described bellow.

I will take Poland as example, current users 3073
expansion level now 1-4-16-64-256-1024 (last level VI, contains total 345 teams or 0,33 per leag.)

expansion level 12 teams options:
1-4-16-64-256-1024, last level VI contains almoust 0 users per league. If you go to V league then 4092 total amount of teams, last level V 2053 teams or 8 per league(out of 12 teams).

I think if you reduce expansion level you will get to many leagues, but what if you do like this
1-2-4-8-32-128-256, last league level is VII with 973 teams or 1,9 per league. So you will have 2 teams in last level fighting to enter higher league

I changed this 64 256 1024 into different nr so i get different nr of teams in last league.
This 2nd approach allows you to go definitelly without playoff game, because 2 (out of 12) teams goes out, and all lower division champions are promoted. It cant be more fair. Its also flexible approach, you can choose where to place point where you change expansion level from x2 to x4

1st aproach without playoff will still be 4 teams out and all lower division champions are promoted. Not half league and plenty games and space to be out of this 4 teams. Also last games will be important if you are in battle for 1st place or in survival. You lose flexibility, so you can come to strange number of teams in last league, but still you can add flexibility if you want only reverse like 1-4-16-64-256-512 (iso 1024).

If you want pictures well sorry :P

i would like to ask how this system will make the game more attractive for users from small countries ? there are many countries with 5 or maybe less active users, and only outcame of this new change for them will be that there will play twice as many games against bots, and only "positive" will be that they will have no problem training 10 youngsters in league matches, but it definitely make the game more competitive in those countries...
Personally i did not want International league just because 1 league game is enough for me, but if i had to choose between 2 league games or 1 league + 1 international league, i would choose the second option without a hesitation.

+ i will say that again but i don't think that you will find many managers who would analyze their opponents and make tactics every 2 or 3 days. and tactics is the thing that gives opportunity to new managers with weaker team to compete with stronger teams. when i started again with new team, i came to the league with average mark 10 points worse than the second worst team in league, but thanks to speacial tactic for each opponent i managed to end 6th and year after 4th(with 7th average mark in league)...

i would like to ask how this system will make the game more attractive for users from small countries ?

Simple!

Let them do their work and make sokker better than before. And when all things are done, have some great promo works for sokker and make small countries a lot bigger!

Problem solved :-)

Exactly. The DEVs would be crazy to try to design a game that is optimal to play when you have a pool of only 5 users.

The fact that there are so many small countries in Sokker (less than 12 users) shouldn't limit the redesigning of this game we all like. You have to have a goal. I could imagine the ambition of the DEVs would be to have 1000+ users in all countries (and maybe I'm even being too conservative here), so please let them redesign the game to be as appealing as possible for such a userbasis.

Only after that they should take into account that at the moment there are many small countries in Sokker. That's when they can try to tweak things so that current users in small countries will still have fun playing it. Obviously they are/should be the ambassadors of this game in their country, so when a good marketing strategy starts paying off and numbers start to increase in the small countries, those ambassadors should enthuse the newcomers.

And if the small countries don't grow, also after changes in the game and a good marketing strategy, they'll find a solution for that then. That's not something they should worry about now. Focus now is on improving the game and growing the user base. Discussions about what to do with the small countries if they don't grow are just distractions from the greater goal and will work counter-productive in this entire process.

Edit: I realize this might sound a bit harsh for those dedicated users in the current small countries, that's not my intention of course. I just want to point out that maybe we shouldn't try too hard to protect what we have, but think about all the possibilities there are in the future now that we finally have some dedicated DEVs again.
(edited)

Who of you do remember "Freekick" online game management? it collapsed about 2013, but it was one of the most complex and enjoying management game...

Many of his features was so nice and original it's a pity they abandoned the game... it was not advertised right and in my opinion the most missing part of the game was a graphic match viewer, it has only text.

I don't want to bother you, I have for sure only "the match engine" explanation/tutorial, I may have on older computer the entire manual, but no sure...

I'll try to post here some of the text, hope not off topping:

Match Engine
Freekick strives to give the match engine a feel of realism, while offering a variety of clear tactical options for managers to indulge in. The focus of the match report is to be informative so the recipes for success can be analyzed. We can with confidence say that our simulation is the best on the market.
Any serious match simulation takes the quality of players and tactical options into account in the match. But few try to simulate the essence of football to enable the managers to make intuitive and football like decisions for their squad. Instead simulations are usually restricted to the game genre and lose their football feeling for anyone who knows the sport. While we do simplify parts of the simulation to make it enjoyable as a game, we believe we rise above the flaw of forgetting what we simulate.
One important, unique aspect of our match engine is that we describe the opportunity part in detail and that the challenges you read about actually occur in the simulation. As FreeKick is bound to no nonsense reports it limits the possibility to flavour comments within the report as everything written there actually occurs in the simulation. If the detail isn't covered in the simulation it cannot be reported according to the no nonsense policy.
Each side gets approximately the same amount of opportunities unless their tactics stipulate otherwise. In this occasion, we disregard the quality of the players and formation of each side as they will get their chance to prove themselves within the opportunities. This practice gives both managers the chance to analyze what went wrong just like an expert would.
The opportunity can be simplified as four steps; starting, midfield, penalty box and goal attempt. The opportunity starts with a pass, dribble or counterattack that brings the ball to the offensive part of the midfield. If the attacking side keeps the ball they will likely try to bring the ball into the box to go for goal. If the defence fails to conquer the ball, the attackers will try to score with the goalkeeper as the last obstacle.
It's fair to call the description in the last paragraph simplified as every player has orders given by the manager that might alter this four step description somewhat(long shots, seek corner...) and the effect of an action might also complicate the opportunity (rebounds, set pieces, counter attacks...). It's not necessary to make advanced choices to win matches, but it is often the best way to utilize specific players.
We also take into consideration that football is a team sport. Although stars are important at any place on the pitch, they are influenced by how good help they have from their team mates. Besides the obvious importance of a great pass, we also take into account the abstract part of football that only the experts usually comment. We see this as quite intuitive, but we explain the thoughts behind the zones in a separate chapter for you to indulge in.
During the match the conditional orders of the manager can come into effect. These orders are given before the match and come into effect when their condition (leading with 2 goals and/or in a certain minute for example) is true. Once again these settings are not necessary to win, but playing more offensive when behind in the second half can lead to an equalizer or even turn the game around. Substituting tired players are also a common conditional order.
Tactical options are described under "Tactics" and we suggest that you read through that section carefully for a good understanding of the tools that are available. FreeKick is a strategic game and it's quite possible to lose while having the best squad if one neglects the match tactics or don't understand the essence of the match simulation.
Details:
The quality of player actions in the match report are described in denominations based on the players skills. Although the denominations in the match report can deviate a fair amount, the average is still the player skill denomination (modified by form and stamina). Other influences to a player action are not incorporated into the match report denomination (such as the zone or positioning influence on a goalie's saving attempt).
^Top
Opportunity Creation
Each side will get a base number of eight opportunities to try to get past the midfield and penalty box of the opponent in order to score a goal. A comparison of midfield skills can add up to four opportunities to the stronger side. Skills used for this comparison is Passing and the lowest average of the offensive pairs (OP+BC) and the defensive pairs (DP+TA). Unless otherwise stated, only the skills of midfielders are used.
Using advanced positions (W, OM, DM) or the Isolate tactical option will give away opportunities to the opponent. Although this is a clear disadvantage for the side using these settings, the upside of directing or diverging opportunities from certain players in midfield is worth it.
There are also opportunities that are dedicated to specific positions. Each Forward or Striker will get an opportunity each and Wing Backs get at least one opportunity if they have decent or higher in Constitution. A Wing Back with Awesome Constitution can even get four personal opportunities, but remember that position based opportunities always will be given to that position.
Although all opportunities will appear during the 90 minutes a full match is scheduled for (and additional ones will be calculated if extra time), the exact amount of opportunities will be recalculated when changes to lineups/tactics force it during the match. If one side uses "isolate" for instance, the other side will get one opportunity for 90 minutes. If that setting is only effect for 45 minutes, then there is only 50% that it will result in an opportunity. Fractions of opportunities will be chances to receive them. This includes flank defenders with a Constitution skill between the target number to get another opportunity.
Opportunities are started by passes or sometimes (if Ball Control is higher than Passing) with dribbles. If the player who starts the opportunity is inadequate in his offensive skills (compared with opponent midfielders), then he risks to start the opportunity with a long pass. The drawback with that is that such a pass never can be beneficial to the assistance calculation (although it still can be negative).
Details:
When in a clear lead, the winning side tend to lose concentration. As a result the leaders won't produce as many opportunities as otherwise expected. If the clear lead is lost, the squad will snap back to reality and go back to normal.

I also like the idea of 2 great leagues:
-amators: all the teams in world (not for every country) /or/ grouped in regions, like "africa", "asia", "balcans" etc... the lowest of the leagues, a paralel system of 4-8-16... (4 amaI, 8 amaII, 16 amaIII)

Then at the end of season best "x" teams promote to
-pro leagues: a 4 unique leagues of mix nations, best qualified teams, divided on how many teams per group you decide... 12-16 teams in Premier // 12-16 in div 1 // 12-16 in div 2 // 12-16 in div 3... or whatever names they have.

(concept from "freekick")

There are a lot more concepts from old "freekick" you may implement in many aspects of a sokker management game.

The ideea of national league championships works only in larger user ones, maybe >500 active users, otherwise in 20 user nations maybe only top league matters, if that too...

Transfers:
-players stays 3-5 days on market (for visibility)
-the system is who offer the most, only the average of top 10 offers shown until the deadline

Training:
-there was a little different system: players had a potential value skill 1-100 (who may raise until let's say 21-23y) and an actual value for every skill (pace/stamina/tech/plmk etc...) Stamina needs a high value in match engine
-any training over the potential is possible, but works 4 times slower (raise/4)
-players don't need to play to train, but playing gets them experience, and experience should have a bigger role.
-every player trains individually, this is better for team performance (aim to win matches not for best/efficient training), not only team order training... or like in sokker: main training is team training and for second/general training you may select for every player... ++ my choice will be like in freekick, you may select for every player the main and second training...

and many more...

"Exactly. The DEVs would be crazy to try to design a game that is optimal to play when you have a pool of only 5 users."

It's not about designing a game that is optimal for 5 players, it is about designing a game that works whether you have 5 players or 5000 players.

They had the option to do this, but decided to ignore all the small countries, and create changes that only help large nations, same as how you can only get large sponsorship money if you are in a large country (example, why does agbell79, in Australia, deserve to get 93 750 $ less than the first 2 divisions of italy when he has a higher ranking. It's not because of beating easy teams, because he is so far ahead of them, he actually loses points when he win).

The people who voted for option 1, also voted for an international system. It was also not clear in the option 2, that the international system as presented, lasted the whole season.

It was obvious from the questions, people wanted 3 games, which is what option 2 has, but the way it was presented made it look like only 1 or 2 games, thus people voted for option 1. If it was presented how it was proposed, then option 2 would have won as people don't want 4 games.

This is the problem with how the current DEV's have presented it, but in the end, the only ones who will lose by doing a poor job will be the DEVs. We can all find new games, and never waste a cent.

If the DEVs truly wanted to find out what people wanted, they would have presented the schedule as we presented the schedule

Achmid woke up after 36 hours non stop sleep.
Uuf, I was worried to never see you again around !

Please, continue to show your true colours.
I'm trying to bring the game together, and people together, you are trying to push people apart, and it shows with your constant comments against Sviktorov and myself.

A good admin would warn you, and ban you from forums, because it is very rude, and the game doesn't need your toxicity.

But please continue if you would like, its a free forum. And the fact you are watching my logins is pretty creepy, because I don't care at all about what you are doing, but you are actively stalking my profile to see what I am doing. Very Creepy

"Well, as the majority of voters wanted the International Cup,"

100% correct Tony. You voted for 4 games, and voted for an international cup, both of which the DEVs decided to take away from your vote.

If they are going to reduce it to 3 games, they should be putting out a vote for either the 2nd league match or an international league, not just making the decision they want

I am ok to be banned if the admins ban in the same time all the wild traders exploiting the arcade bug.

Really, I am ready to sacrifice myself for the good of the game, so please DO IT !


PS : I have nothing against you and my friend Svitkorov, take it easy.