Subject: Youth reform - poll

Your test only covers players at exactly 21y because at early 20 only really top players have over €500k value.

And yes, even 21y DEF with less than €500k can reach 2x17. If in low form and talented, it is possible for 3x17 ATT too.

Inevitably, talented young top skills will finish very high in any case, progression is linear.
So it’s almost the ratio I expose for u21 : 0,15 top high skilled DEF by teams. It may be a problem, but a very few clubs have top multi divine players.

Then, If we increase training progression on the highest skills, it will inevitably finish with less skills but at a new standard of multi ET or magic, and there will be even more tops multi skilled (bottleneck principle).

Or, devs could break the juniors with even less skills, less super talent and less lucky draws. So that academy will be even more painful than now, but for sure, less top players in the end.

Or, they can break the linearity of the training progression….
I did not see other options.

Anyway, we are far from youths reform topic, but I just hope that Devs will not reform a junior system to solve their problem of too “much multi divine/et/magic”

Your test only covers players at exactly 21y because at early 20 only really top players have over €500k value.

Off course it’s mostly 21y players. But I can do the same thing for U20 (so less than €500) I’m quite sure the ratio by teams will be the same for it’s age. I just take 21y as a symbolic reference for young’ ending.

And yes, even 21y DEF with less than €500k can reach 2x17. If in low form and talented, it is possible for 3x17 ATT too.

I take values adjusted to form. Off course, we could reach 2x17 under 500k€. But 2x17 def without high secondaries skills are part of the “too much multi divine players” or even « top def players » ?

Even if I take €300k as I reference, it would not change much the ratio by teams.

Once again it’s really depend of what we called too much skilled players. If it’s multiple divine, ok, but how many skills at divine? And how much of this players in the game we need ? I don’t know and it’s not really my obsession, I think there are much more priorities in this game.

For me I count 1k « valuable def players » by age after 21y’. It’s a small ratio by teams. If multi divine is such a problem for top teams ok. Fine. But can we say there re « too much valuable players » in this game? If not, for sure, the current juniors draws will not help.
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Per team yes, but there is no way to have high quality players for all teams and so it should be. For the top 10% of teams there is plenty of choice and we can see this in their squads.

And, again, I think €500k def at early 21y is a pretty good level and I'm even surprised there are so many of them. They can easily reach 2x17 with 30+ secondaries (of course not every one will be trained properly), which isn't enough to win the CL, but I'd bet the devs consider them for "top def players".
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And, again, I think €500k def at early 21y is a pretty good level and I'm even surprised there are so many of them.

€500k DEF value is a pretty cool valuable level, but that's it, they are not multi divine. If we think in term of linear progression it could be too much multi divine in the end, ok, but in term of absolute 1k valuable U21 DEF is it too much? !

And what's about 21y players under 300k€ top form ? Are they valuable ?

Here is the distribution of 21y DEF players (values in 10k€. 50 is € 500k)

[url=https://ibb.co/gFWwsMf][/url]

Most of them are around 10k€ value (at form 18). We clearly see the "bell curve" of how junior draws system produce massive worthless players and the long tails of lucky draws that comes into the hand of a too few teams.

"Too much top players" is not a problem of youths. That's the point. If Devs want to fix that, they have to reform the linear training system, but its off topic. In the meantimes, they could also fix the too "much worthless" young's" and the injustice in term of lucky draws between academies, that's the topic.

EDIIT : rectified, graphic i not U21, but 21y DEF only.
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+1

Do you have info about fired players after they are promoted from academy? Are these included in your chart? ????

No idea. This chart is only from players database, not juniors. So direct fired are not included, logically.

my youth school will probably never have 15-20 kids in it at once, simply because I can't afford to waste the money, for the sake of getting better assessments of my youth. I find it completely useless to train anyone who's going to leave the school at age 20, or age 19 with mediocre skill count.

Too many juniors are simply not worth investing money in. Sure, each space is 1k/week, but that's per space used. I'm too busy trying to reinvest into my own team and stadium to worry about training youth that will never sell for anything.

So, going up to excellent in a skill should still go very fast for 26 year olds, but going to unearthly and divine should take around a full season for young players.
It's exactly that...reaching the top should be difficult, but reaching decent levels should be easy.

You are completely right!
More balanced players, few "top divines" (whatever DEVs define this way - I have no player w/ at least 2 Divine skills, it's difficult to reach it training!) and, important, more fun to everybody.
Nailed it!

I have no player w/ at least 2 Divine skills, it's difficult to reach it training!

it's not difficult

what difficulty do you find in it?

I've not set the training in this direction.

Thousands ? How many thousands ?

Do a simple math...you don't even need actual numbers...just an estimation...

There are 96 countries. Let's say half of them are small countries...less than 20 users...
So that's approx 50 countries with less than 20 users, so say 10 users on average = 500 HUMAN managers approx...
Then let's say 200 of them have no multi divine players, but the other 300 does and approx 25% have more than 1...
So let's say 75 teams (1/4th) have more than 1 multi divine player, so let's say 200 in total ( I think it's a fair number ) And the other 125 have 1 so that makes 325 multi divine players in the small countries...

So that's about 65% of all teams in small countries who have multi divine players. Now let's say we take that number into account for ALL teams within sokker...

7500 teams... 65% = 4875...so that's the amount of multi divine players within the game...approx.
And multi divine doesn't mean 5x divine! 2 times divine also is multi divine...
A def with divine pace and defending is calculated as a top def...
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A def with divine pace and defending is calculated as a top def...

not really
a top def has superdivine main skills and outstanding+ sideskills

Let’s say, It is your simple math, base on your own estimation of speculations. But it is not so much tops.

I have one top def (2 x divin 3 x 11, top form) at 2,1M€. Base on your definition of top def, so it should start at 2 M€ value (adjusted to max form). So I count 1,338 tops identified as def in database. For 6,792 active teams, it's 0.2 top def by teams.

Distribution of top DEF in database

[url=https://ibb.co/J38s8GR][/url]

Ultimately, I don’t care much about multi-divines, or any definition of "too much top players". If devs want to remove any multi-divine players in game, it’s ok, do it. But as I said, it's off topic with young's draws and academy, only their player training system is responsible of producing higher skills.
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But these 2xSD players or ATTS 3xSD should be reduced by ME which they wont touch (more relevance to 2nd skills) or another way that dont affect all the players

I am saying this because if you try to penalize all the players, then we might have very bad MIDS, only the stars would be good enough to enjoy the game, also it will encurage people to continue playing with 2 mids or maybe one? thisgame already penalize a lot the mids (or in favor of DEF-ATTs teams), thats why most of the top games are tenis games 5 vs 5 defenders, even 6 Defs some teams

I just hope they get a good solution on youths, bring back useful youths and remove the irreal super stars